Karen Ciambriello painting stolen from Totness

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  • #6247

    gbl
    Participant

    If anyone has any more reliable info on the Karen Ciambriello painting stolen from Totnes please post. As I found this site saying it had been recovered, and someone was sent to jail! But I couldn't find any more reliable info to confirm it.http://www.collectinguk.com/cgi-bin/cuk.cgiThanks

    #9039

    Christopher Raven
    Participant

    Yes, the painting is now safely back in the Gallery. Stolen by a gentleman on remand, he was quickly apprehended by the boys in blue and will now have a few extra mail bags to stitch. I wonder if the price of the painting has now increased?

    #9040

    gbl
    Participant

    If not a rise in value, then its at least given it a bit of extra history or notoriety – which can only help its self-worth as a painting!Personally I think its a very good painting in itself, and could be made into a print (its on a similar par to the other prints of; Karen, Anna, Esther etc.)! TLF should get it in print, along with many others that are just waiting to be printed!!

    #9041

    Christopher Raven
    Participant

    I thought it was a rather ghastly painting and the thief had no taste, 'Karen At The Bedroom Door' was much better, but perhaps a little too large to fit inside his raincoat so I gave him the benefit of the doubt.

    #9042

    sartre
    Participant

    Perhaps it might be better to impound the painting and release the thief…

    #9043

    gbl
    Participant

    I haven't seen 'Karen At The Bedroom Door' so can't comment. But I think the market can stand many more unsigned prints - look at Monet, Picasso, all the 'high-print-output' big sellers. Its whats helping to self-fuel thier own longevity - I think its a 'must' from a promotional point of view. The RL prints are a whole parallel market to all other RL activity - they make RL accessible to more people!

    #9044

    Christopher Raven
    Participant

    Delightful idea Sartre.I take your points gbl, but with (I think) in excess of 20,000 signed prints in circulation, the majority of which are still situated in the south west you only have to look at the ebay results over the last year or so to see that 90% will not sell unless at a bargain price. Robert does not occupy the same space in the current market as Monet and Picasso etc. I agree that promotion and accessibility is essential - prints and posters play a part in that - at this stage in the game it may have more to do with costs and economics.

    #9045

    sartre
    Participant

    The RL prints are a whole parallel market to all other RL activity - they make RL accessible to more people!

    Which Robert Lenkiewicz? The one who might join the pantheon of great artists or the one who dashed off tacky oil sketches of women? Personally I think there are more than enough prints from/inspired by Project 18. I don't think you have to dumb down to make an artist "accessible". People are intelligent enough to respond to more sophisticated art. ROL was very interested in communicating his ideas widely and the print market is poisoning the well for those ideas and the works that go with them.

    #9046

    gbl
    Participant

    Oh come on, 'tacky oil sketches of women' is not a good phrase – when does anyones oil sketch of a woman become tacky? So why desribe any of RL's as tacky (not that that phrase was yours originally)!I suppose I'm just thinking of accessibility. I would like to think that the RL name could grow beyond the South West, but as CR has pointed out; the majority of prints are mainly knocking around in the South West.

    #9047

    sartre
    Participant

    Oh come on, 'tacky oil sketches of women' is not a good phrase - when does anyones oil sketch of a woman become tacky? So why desribe any of RL's as tacky (not that that phrase was yours originally)!

    You're right, tacky isn't the correct word. I should have used Robert's own description: kitsch.

    I suppose I'm just thinking of accessibility. I would like to think that the RL name could grow beyond the South West, but as CR has pointed out; the majority of prints are mainly knocking around in the South West.

    If every home in Britain had a print of Anna or Karen it would be a disaster for Robert Lenkiewicz's reputation as a thinking painter.We're back to the central problem of Robert Lenkiewicz's output. As Francis has touched on on another thread, it's an unavoidable and uncomfortable truth that ROL produced a lot of poor quality work (by his standards at least) to pay the bills. In my opinion it's a bad idea to saturate the market with yet more of the same prints, particularly when there is a huge body of different and better work which could be dipped into.I'm not suggesting we all place orders for "Albert shitting his trousers" but it seems to me that there are any number of other paintings which are aesthetically pleasing and which would make excellent prints - this website's gallery has plenty. Since ROL is not in the same market as Vettriano, Martin Leighton or Mark Spain, his work doesn't have to - and shouldn't - compete with theirs.Does anyone else feel the same way about the current state of the print market? TLF has made a few tentative steps in the right direction by choosing some of his earlier work for a limited edition but if they were to choose from his later masterpieces (such as Syd) would anyone else buy one?

    #9048

    Christopher Raven
    Participant

    I understand your point of view here Sartre, I'm sure many others do also, but , firstly, it's important not to generalise – both Esther Rear Views, and Anna In The Pink Dress were excellent paintings and all released as limited edition signed prints. I would not consider any of these to do anything but enhance Robert's reputation.

    #9049

    marlowe
    Participant

    both Esther Rear Views, and Anna In The Pink Dress were excellent paintings and all released as limited edition signed prints. I would not consider any of these to do anything but enhance Robert's reputation.

    Am I right in saying that both these are silk screen prints which have a higher value where the new prints are not?

    #9050

    gbl
    Participant

    I dont disagree with you Sartre, except I dont think it would be a disaster if 'every home in Britain had an Anna or a Karen'; ROL was producing the prints in his lifetime, and I'm sure he found it very useful (financial or otherwise) to make these prints to help him achieve other things on the back of the prints.Would his work as a thinking painter be compomised by more prints? Dont the TLF need more funds to help set-up a permenant gallery (the more funds, the better the gallery), most of the print-owning public aren't too interested in the intellectual side of RL's work - they were just inadvertantly funding the cause, and presumably still could (there's still quite a boyant print market out there) if TLF were a bit more proactive. And yes, there is plenty of other great RL work that has print potential. Although I dont know a great deal about TLF (I do know there are one or two women involved in running it), there does seem to be a lack of ambition comming through. They apparently own the copyright to reproduce his work, and seem to have done littlewith all the great potential that there is (if you agree with more prints being produced that is).

    #9051

    007
    Participant

    gbl said:

    there's still quite a boyant print market out there

    Is that true?One can't help noticing that last month something like 22 prints were on e-Bay and managed to attract no bids.

    #9052

    marlowe
    Participant

    26 prints on ebay since 3 July – just one sold @ £410, Study of Esther – an early Washington Green print.

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